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| forBetterAnd |
 Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 1:21 pm Post subject: Too much "bounce" to their stride |
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Joined: 21 May 2006
Posts: 5
Location: USA - Arizona
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| I am looking for advice, I am a high school coach. A few of my kids have a little too much "bounce" to their stride. One 7th grade girl in particular has good form, but spends a little too much time going up and down. She does run on her toes and has a high back kick as she goes through her stride (if this makes any difference). I feel that she is wasting energy. As I watch the very good high school runners, their energy is going forward. Understand that my school's philosophy on 7th and 8th graders is to under train them. We're talking less than 2 miles a day and very little and very short speed sessions. I realize that as they grow and gain strength they may naturally eliminate this problem. But, are there any drills or exercises that these kids can do to smooth out their running stride? |
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| gtrain |
| Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2006 4:29 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 21 Aug 2006
Posts: 57
Location: Australia - VIC
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It sounds like they're trying to run with their legs and not using arm drive. You might like to try some arm exercises, the arms will help speed up the legs meaning they can't spend too long in the air.
Getting back to basic, efficient running technique may also help. Running on toes is not too much trouble when athletes are running fast, but if it is occuring during jogging, or the foot landing in front of the hip, then it can place a great deal of stress on the body.
The other query is are these girls doing the right event? If she is naturally bouncy, let her do some triple jump or high jump. |
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| worldc |
| Posted: Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Joined: 24 Feb 2006
Posts: 6
Location: USA - California
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If your runner appears to be too bouncy, it could be caused more by her arm swing than her mid-foot strike. Some runners are simply built with foot, ankle and Achilles/calf connections that make it absolutely natural to run on the balls of their feet. So, first see if you can talk her down to a heel strike. If she comes completely unglued, just let her run naturally and don't worry about it. More miles and experience will tend to dampen her "enthusiastic" stride.
You might want to see if her arm swing is "lifting" her off the ground. If she is pumping her arms too high on the forward swing (hands swinging up as high as her shoulders), change the angle at her elbow to a more open one. She may now have an acute angle at the elbow and by lowering her forearm until the angle is closer to 90 degrees, her arm swing should not have the tendency to lift her up with each stride.
There are many more possible solutions than this, but I hope this is worth a try.
Good luck |
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| mjroth |
| Posted: Mon Dec 04, 2006 6:22 pm Post subject: |
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Joined: 15 Jun 2006
Posts: 1
Location: USA - New York
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| All of this is occuring because of a few areas of general body weakness. The athlete in question has a lack of pelvic stability and a result or cause also has a lack of foot/ankle strength. Not sure here whether the chicken came before the egg or vice versa. Your athlete will also need ot work on general core strength too. This means more than crunches and must include lower back, oblique and static core work too. Doing crunches alone will only make the problem worse, as muscle imbalances will be further exacerbated. |
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| Coach Barr |
| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:48 pm Post subject: too much bounce |
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 94
Location: USA - California
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What if nothing is wrong except they are running to slow?
What if nothing is wrong at all?
Sometimes I see athletes sprinting and running and wonder how they do it, the point is that they do it. Would change make them better, Don't know.
If anything I would get them off of the ball of the foot, as that will tend to cause shin problems especially if the foot gets too far in front of the COM before contacting the ground.
The slower you run the closer you should be to running flat footed.
The high heel kick is a result of spending the extra time on the ground due to the lack of active leg action. When the support leg comes off the ground the knee does not immediatley recover to the front. So the legs flexes at the knee and the heel flicks up high. That action also allows the foot to drop slightly in front of the COM, as the leg recovers to the front, allowing for an easy pass of the COM over the foot.
How do you get them off of the ball of the foot? Don't know? Is it arm action, is it not relaxing enough, is it structural, in other words without seeing them to many variables to deal with to give an exact solution.
Try one thing, let them run barefooted and see if anything changes. |
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| drunnermr |
| Posted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 5:31 am Post subject: Had this problem in highschool |
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Joined: 28 Jan 2007
Posts: 3
Location: USA - Ohio
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I had this exact same problem in high school. My camber was EXTREMELY slow (about 136/min) and I had a very long stride. I felt like I was running normal, but I quickly found out that running abnormally worked better. Try doing what I did. Tell her that as soon as her feet came off the ground, to put it right back down. Do NOT let her get a full stride in, but what feels like 1/2 a stride. When I first tried it, I got exhausted, and my pace went from 7:00 to 6:20, but after 3-4 practices, the speed naturally came down, and I held 6:45 pace for an 8 mile run, where i used to hold a 7:15 pace for that distance. It will feel very weird to her, and she won't like it, but tell her to give it a few weeks. My mile time went from 4:45, to 4:38 in 2 weeks, and my PR was 4:33. My 800 time dropped from 2:14 to 2:06, and ended up 2:04. Tell her to give it a couple weeks, and it'll naturally take effect in races.
Remember, what worked for me, may not work for everyone. Just fiddle around until you find something that works, but most importantly, get her foot placement right before she breaks an ankle, or has knee problems. |
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| Coach Barr |
| Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 11:23 pm Post subject: re-visit this topic. |
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 94
Location: USA - California
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Two things may cause what you are describing.
One is that is she is bending too much at the knee and hip joint.
Being on your toes and excessive bend at those joints will make you bounce like a pogo stick.
How do you prevent it?
By getting them off of their toes and by getting them to transfer the weight over their foot sooner.
Last look at is the hands are leading the arm action or the elbow.
If the hand is leading in both direction, the elbow joint will open and close.
If the elbow is leading the way in both direction then the elbow joint stays fixed.
More action with the hands and also check to see if and when the wrist break.
The second issue is poor leg recovery. If the runner rises up to the toe before the foot leaves the ground they are really pushing themselves by doing a toe lift. This causes the hips to rise excessively.
How to prevent is, the recovery legs need to recover faster. How does that happen by increasing the negative foot speed of the recovery leg. |
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| Coach Barr |
| Posted: Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:15 am Post subject: too much bounce |
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Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 94
Location: USA - California
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Often you may hear about someone having too much bounce when sprinting or running.
The person is not bouncing too much but sinking too much on each step as they run or sprint
At initial ground contact, the leg should be stiff or stiffen. The amount of flexion in the knee and hip joint should be minimal and should not increase.
What increases the amount the hips drop or sink is the degree of flexion (Dorsi), at the ankle joint, that occurs during the support phase. The total amount of flexion (dorsi) at the ankle joint is determine by when doris flexion of the toes occur.
What people perceive as bouncing action when it is really a sinking action that is occurring as their weight is being transferred from behind the foot to in front of the foot.
Limiting the amount of ankle flexion as this weight shifts occurs is the key to reducing the amount of sinking that occurs or perceived bouncing.
You lift up more than bounce while sprinting or running with the amount of lift determined by how high up on your toes you get. The faster you run the less the lift created.
What does it all mean, too much bounce?
Longer ground contact time, shorter stride length and greater exposure to lower limb injuries. |
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